I need an opinion on a 3D pony model..

[Jorichi]

Because I felt like the previous one failed (even though you guys said it looked alright), I retried it.
I like this one a bit better though. And don't worry I've still got the other one as well.

I don't really like this shot from the front though...
The big lock of hair is pointed straight forward, but I'm planning on making it hang towards the side a bit.
The mane is up next.

[LightningFire]

I guess that IS better than the first.

[Jorichi]

The mane is pretty much complete. Just needs to be more flowing.

I'll tweak it.

Left to do:
- Add tail.
- Add wings.
- Add texture.
And probably shitloads of things more.

I've been thinking about the wings for a while now. I can make realistic feathers, or go for a style closer to that of the show.
Anyone got any thoughts on how I should make the wings? 'Cuz I sure don't...

[LightningFire]

Give us pics of 2 versions of wings. Anyways, great job with the mane :). Oh, and if I were you, I would leave a download link for 2 reasons: So people can make their own, and just in case, if ALL of your files suddently erase or something.

[trosh]

i remember seeing the incredibles and thinking woah, now they actually know how to make hair look real. That was in 2004, so don't expect a simple model to have realistic hair :S

[Jorichi]

That's the method of 'making it look like the show'. This is just a very basic example.

As for the other example (making it look 'realistic') is quite a hassle to make an example of.
But I can explain: Just like most grass is made in most games:
They take a single face (one flat square) and texture it with an image of grass (transparency creating a more realistic feel to it).
Usually also crossing two of them to create a more of a 3d feel to it.
The polygon looks like this:

But with texture like these plants:

If I use this style it'll require allot of textures (and fitting styled textures ofcourse) and layers of them to make it look nice.
One down side to this is the point of view: Looking from the side will make it almost disappear as it is paper thin.

i remember seeing the incredibles and thinking woah, now they actually know how to make hair look real. That was in 2004, so don't expect a simple model to have realistic hair :S

I can do that (requires allot of Ram of my pc to render that though), I could even give the entire model a coat. Maya has a wide variety of options for that, but I don't know how to work with that yet. But I know that creating realistic hair on a model made from an unrealistic show makes it look incredibly weird. Especially when you try Pinkie's hair or something. But maybe that's just my personal opinion... Plus I'm not really aiming for the realistic style, I'm aiming more for the style the show has. Although I am planning to add a bit of shading through texture to make it slightly more 'hair-like' instead of just a polygon with a single color.

I really want to know how to make realistic hair and such, but it's not in my agenda for the near future. Maybe you'll see a picture of a model with realistic hair in the far future...

[trosh]

hair is very strange because of the shadows. I'm not saying it should look realistic as such, but I can't think of a good way to make hair on a 3d model that can fit in any angle with the look in a 2d comic where graphic simplifications/tricks make hair look better.

[Jorichi]

hair is very strange because of the shadows. I'm not saying it should look realistic as such, but I can't think of a good way to make hair on a 3d model that can fit in any angle with the look in a 2d comic where graphic simplifications/tricks make hair look better.

I agree with you 100%. That's why it has been so troublesome making the hair and mane. I was hoping certain shaders might make it look better, but I still have my doubts about it all. It sure is a challenge though...

[trosh]

maybe (and that's just a suggestion) you could try rarity-style hair. I've said before I wouldn't want to have to do that but you seem to know how to use helix or whatever. Instead of a thick, bushy mane, a "thin", swirly "sheet" of hair could do the trick better. just saying. and it would be kind of easy to add simple lines on that when derp's bushy mane is plain.

[Jorichi]

maybe (and that's just a suggestion) you could try rarity-style hair. I've said before I wouldn't want to have to do that but you seem to know how to use helix or whatever. Instead of a thick, bushy mane, a "thin", swirly "sheet" of hair could do the trick better. just saying. and it would be kind of easy to add simple lines on that when derp's bushy mane is plain.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say. Are you suggesting me to make Derpy's hair plain like Rarity's, or are you suggesting me to just try Rarity's hair?
(I'm putting my bet on the second one)

Rarity's hair would be easier, yes. But simply curling up a plain won't work (imo), it needs at least a bit (minimal) of thickness to create some volume (that's no problem though).
The helix was just a thought that passed my mind, but I don't think editing a helix to shape would be easier then to manually curl around a plain.

As for drawing some simple lines on them there are two ways to do this:
The manual 3D brush: Directly draw some lines onto the model (this requires allot of patience and skill, but saves you from the hassle with texture files).
The UV Mapping method: You basically 'unfold' the polygon of the model to a 2D image and save it as an image. You can then edit the image and load it back in to apply to the polygon.
There are probably more ways to do this, but these are methods I am familiar with.

[trosh]

it looks like you have more tools than you need lol I'm used to "basic", "more exact" sketchup skillz
I'm just thinking swirly textured hair might have a nicer finish.
PS : searching for "3d hair model" on google image reveals that most people get around akward methods involving lots of texture and sh*t

[Jorichi]

It most likely would. But Derpy's hair just isn't 'swirly'. xD

Rarity's hair will be easier as it doesn't use 2D to its advantage to make it look nicer, like you said earlier. So yeah, it will most certainly come out way nicer.
The Unicorn Base is already done, so I'm likely to try to make Rarity if I need a break from the Derpy Dilemma.
It's just that Derpy's hair needs more improvising as it uses the 2D advantage. (I'm already happy I got this close xD)

As a beginner (and self taught) at this stuff I tend to use the 'hit and miss' approach. I learn from every miss, I like that. :p

Yeah the '3D hair model' search shows that texture method allot. It's ok for games and such.
But those are aimed for more realism then trying to capture a 2D cartoon style...
I guess I'm fighting and struggling to keep the MLP style.

[trosh]

well ... final suggestion ... that searched also showed that hair which doesn't rely on texture usually has many "lumps" or "locks", like this or that

[Jorichi]

Yes, indeed. That's the approach I'm planning to use for Pinkie's hair (which is lumpy and curly and such) mostly with minor texturing. I could try to add more locks to Derpy's hair (as I basically just copied the picture which only has like 5 or 6 locks of hair), I'm just not sure where to place them and such to avoid ruining Derpy's 'look'....
I'm just really unsure what to do atm. So I'm gonna try everything :D (it'll take time but it will be good practice!).

[LightningFire]

Are you planning to make anypony else, and what are you going to do with Derpy after you're done?

[Jorichi]

Are you planning to make anypony else, and what are you going to do with Derpy after you're done?

Well, this is my first model ever. It was made to learn how to use the program while I progressed in my self schooling.
So I haven't got anything big planned for it or something. I might attempt to make the mane six and maybe even some others.
But I'm clueless on what to do with them when they're finished as of yet.
Sadly I'm struggling to find some free time these past few days, so progress is very slow.

[LightningFire]

Is there any progress? And I would like to know HOW do you make that.

[Jorichi]

I'm learning some new techniques at the moment, so progress is minimal on the current model.

I usually start out with a plane square divided in 2 to 6 faces. I extract the edges to add faces and I drag the vertexes into position.
I hardly ever work with an image plane for reference, it somehow doesn't work for me. It's painstakingly time consuming work, but I like it.

I started with the legs, I made a plane as the bottom of the hoof and extruded the edges upwards to make a cylinder-like shape. I edited them
each step to make them look like legs.
As for the rump I used a basic 'outline' to get the general shape of it, which I then filled up by extruding faces over and over.
Once the general shape is finished I edit it to perfection using various tools to my advantage.
Then I attached the rump and legs together.
The same technique is used on the face (the lower right picture, looks horrible doesn't it? xD Thank god that came out allot better)

The neat thing is I only need to make 1 half of the pony (notice how it only has 1 front and 1 hind leg). By editing the mesh I can quickly mirror the geometry on the X axis and make the program attach it instantly (making it 1 solid polygon).

Some friends and people I met online wanted me to stream my next 'project'. But I'm highly skeptical about this, I'm a newb at this and I have no plans thus far (just some minor idea's). I like modeling the ponies, but I just can't capture the beauty and cuteness of the show itself (don't start thinking I'm gonna give up though), so I'm thinking on starting something of my own soon.

[Jorichi]

I experimented with hair some more. Realistic hair is hard to do (especially for a beginner like me xD), so I'm gonna stick with the basic polygon hair.
I learned allot the past few days, though.

But somehow I thought this was worth showing:

I made the hair less thick and round. I made it symmetrical as well, as it still is on the back. I edited the front lock to fold to the side a bit, to give it some more dynamic feel. It looks really good to me from some angles, but others (like the back) don't feel quite right just yet...



Any thoughts?

[Kyle Prior]

I think it looks as good as a 3d model can when being based off of a 2d cartoon. As far as I can tell, it's spot on! I'm only basing this off of pictures from google and youtube clips, but I think you're getting as close to the look of the show as you can get with a 3d model. Are you sure you're a beginner at this?

[LightningFire]

Now that I looked closer, the snout (AKA nose) is too much..... square.

[Jorichi]

I think it looks as good as a 3d model can when being based off of a 2d cartoon. As far as I can tell, it's spot on! I'm only basing this off of pictures from google and youtube clips, but I think you're getting as close to the look of the show as you can get with a 3d model. Are you sure you're a beginner at this?

Spot on? I still have my doubts, but I guess that's pretty much in the details. But yes, I am a beginner (for about 2 to 3 months, I think) and self taught by the trail-and-error approach, the 'getting started' manual and the internet (Only when I screw things up). This model is pretty much my practice/learning model...

Now that I looked closer, the snout (AKA nose) is too much..... square.

Hmm, now that you say that I see it too. xD
I'll see what I can do (*Amazing skills of trail-and-error activate!*).
I just think to round will make it more like a pig-nose, but we'll see soon.

[LightningFire]

Cutie Marks

When are you going to add them?

[Jorichi]

Probably after the wings are done. But I need Photoshop for easy UVMapping, gotta ask my sister for a copy.

[LightningFire]

Have you done any progress?

[Jorichi]

Have you done any progress?

Sort of. The base models have been edited (the nose you pointed out earlier and other small stuff). But Derpy hasn't.
I've been working on something else, but I don't want to show too much this early in this project.
I've been creating my Ponysona (or however they call it) to get a profile started to show my 3D stuff.

The pony:
Name: Virtual Reality.
Cutie Mark: A small chip.
It's a stallion unicorn who lived a harsh past, he lost the one he loved very early in life. Giving up on the world he tried to ease his emotional wounds by creating a hologram of the one he lost. Sadly this creation only made him remember the horrible accident that took her life, so the hologram turned out differently. The hologram, with outstanding AI, became his best friend and assistant with the name Artificial Module-Y III or Amy for short.
Virtual Reality dedicated the rest of his life by using his magic and capabilities with technology to make dreams and desires closer to reality.
Virtual Reality is so dedicated to his work that he is rarely seen in Ponyville, only during the night when he's going out to buy components.

These are the only picture's I'll show as far as this project goes:
Concept Art of Virtual Reality and A.M.Y. III:
http://i.imgur.com/P1KGM.png
The Scene in basic polygon and separate objects (this picture is quite outdated):
http://i.imgur.com/zQnoQ.png
Prototype skin for A.M.Y III tested out on the Derpy model:
http://i.imgur.com/WAHBb.png

While I'm working on the basics of this model I'm trying to solve the following:
- Virtual Reality's colors.
- A.M.Y III's colors (yes, it's light blue in the picture, but I'm thinking of changing that).

Progress has been going quite fast so far (for a beginner).

[LightningFire]

Position of explotion == Position of mind

Your OC looks cool!

[Camewel]

You realise == is a comparison right? You only want the one equals sign.

[Sky]

You realise == is a comparison right? You only want the one equals sign.

The comparison is assumed to be true. I do this as well.

[LightningFire]

Oops, I didn't mean to do that.

[Camewel]

If that's true, a large portion of code is broken due to bad comparison checking.
2 == 3 doesn't mean 2 = 3 otherwise A == B would simply be a replacement for true.

[LightningFire]

I have no idea of what you just wrote.

[Sky]

If that's true, a large portion of code is broken due to bad comparison checking.
2 == 3 doesn't mean 2 = 3 otherwise A == B would simply be a replacement for true.

Yes, but in this case
assumption==true
since A) this isn't really code and B) it's kind of part of an if statement - if one looks at it correctly.

Anyway, one or both of us should stop because we don't want this happening again.

[Camewel]

Yes, but in this case
assumption==true
since A) this isn't really code

If it wasn't really code then he'd have used the single = sign.

B) it's kind of part of an if statement - if one looks at it correctly.

Not all if statements evaluate to true.

Anyway, one or both of us should stop because we don't want this happening again.

Fair point. However...

Yes, but in this case
assumption==true

assumption==true

==

[Jorichi]

Skipping the coding chat as that isn't really my expertise:

Position of explotion == Position of mind

Your OC looks cool!

Thanks, I really tried to give him a neat background story and all. I'm just not sure what colors to give him yet though.
This got me curious on your pony's story, would you tell me/us? :P
I thought of making a thread for people to post ponysona's, but I figured there are already enough pony threads...

Btw; I'm currently scaling the rump and limb sizes of my models (together with the head ofcourse) to get that cuteness of the chibi-like bodies of the ponies. I thought the current size was a bit odd, stretched out and all. I might post an update when VR is up to scale. It is quite a set back in the progress, but not all is lost. Most of it is easily edited.
I found an image on a Google search of a pony's help lines for drawing, this helps me allot to scale the model to the correct sizes for maximum cuteness. These kind of images really make me progress in my work:


EDIT:
Well, here is the scaled, re-sized and edited Virtual Reality and A.M.Y. III:
http://i.imgur.com/orRko.png
It looks more pony-ish to me now. I'll be attaching the limbs to the rest of the body later today.
Compared to this: http://i.imgur.com/zQnoQ.png. It's quite an improvement in my eyes. xD

[Kyle Prior]

... I really tried to give him a neat background story and all. I'm just not sure what colors to give him yet though.

I actually kind of enjoyed reading the background story a bit.

EDIT:
Well, here is the scaled, re-sized and edited Virtual Reality and A.M.Y. III:
http://i.imgur.com/orRko.png
It looks more pony-ish to me now. I'll be attaching the limbs to the rest of the body later today.
Compared to this: http://i.imgur.com/zQnoQ.png. It's quite an improvement in my eyes. xD

It's looking pretty good! You said you use Maya, right? Do you need any special knowledge, or did you just jump right in with some exploration and some tutorial videos? I ask, because I'm thinking about trying my hand at it. My first attempt at 3d modeling was some experimentation with google sketchup v0.6 or something.. I made a box with a window.

On a side note, I really like imgur pictures with pronounceable names.

[Jorichi]

I actually kind of enjoyed reading the background story a bit.

I've actually written his story more detailed in a notepad.

It's looking pretty good! You said you use Maya, right? Do you need any special knowledge, or did you just jump right in with some exploration and some tutorial videos? I ask, because I'm thinking about trying my hand at it. My first attempt at 3d modeling was some experimentation with google sketchup v0.6 or something.. I made a box with a window.

Maya 2011 to be exact.
But if you just want to try 3D modeling I would suggest using Blender. It's a free to use 3D modeling and animation program (I believe the animated movie 'Big Buck Bunny' was made with this). I also heard someone refer to SolidWorks (not sure what it is), a bit more technical I guess. Maya might just be a bit to much to handle if you're 'just gonna try it'.
I used the getting started manual to... well... get me started. But I turned to just trying things out. However, with Maya, this is quite 'dangerous' to do as you can easily change you workspace completely without the know-how of how to change it all back without having to reinstall it all completely. So yeah, compared to Blender, Maya is quite unforgiving.
So before using a program like Maya start with a program like Blender. Just to know how the 3D modeling environment works (the basics are practically the same). Blender will not seem quite as user-friendly as Maya does at first sight, but Blender hammers in the basics quite fast. I believe they also have some nice tutorials to get you started.

If you really are sure you want to stick with it, you should really roam the web and actually start out with the program you think is suited for your needs.

[LightningFire]

About my OC's story, well....... I just realized how extremely stupid it is, so I'm just going to say one tiny part:

He was born on the sun.

[Jorichi]

Sounds epic. So are you going to rewrite it or something?
Did your parents do something more evil then Luna to get banished to the sun...? o.O
Nah the thought of it just sounds too cruel...

[LightningFire]

Sounds epic.

You really think so??? Ok, I'll post it when I can. Or just go to the aaaaa Show, go to OC uploader, go to the gallery, and then try to find it somewhere in all the other OCs.

[Kyle Prior]

Maya 2011 to be exact.
But if you just want to try 3D modeling I would suggest using Blender. It's a free to use 3D modeling and animation program (I believe the animated movie 'Big Buck Bunny' was made with this). .... Maya might just be a bit to much to handle if you're 'just gonna try it'.

Rather than just trying it I was actually hoping to use it to make 3d stuff to put in place of videos so people would have something to look at when listening to my music when (if) I put it up on youtube.

I used the getting started manual to... well... get me started. But I turned to just trying things out. However, with Maya, this is quite 'dangerous' to do as you can easily change you workspace completely without the know-how of how to change it all back without having to reinstall it all completely. So yeah, compared to Blender, Maya is quite unforgiving.

I'm just gonna blindly fling myself in the general direction of Maya and hope a professional quality model comes out.. Hope it works. I flung myself at FL Studio and I can now make good quality music (sometimes) I'm hoping the same strategy works here. If that fails, then I'll try blender.

I had blender installed on one of my old computers.. it was old enough that it took a few seconds to render an octahedron. Obviously, the computer was so old that I couldn't make anything useful in an acceptable amount of time. I gave up because it was frustrating just waiting for simple shapes to render.. I never actually thought about trying blender again. A bit more recently I had downloaded a program called Anim8or and managed to make a happy face. I animated the eyes. it looked pretty good, but I wanted something ...better. But I guess starting with the more basic things and working my way up would be the best way to go.



Speaking of that bunny, I think I saw big buck bunny files somewhere on the internet.. too lazy to look right now..

[Jorichi]

Yeah, Blender has allot of open source projects. These projects are really neat to watch and are always full of techniques to learn from. Maya hardly has any. Because Blender is free to use, it's quite easy to find stuff for it like tutorials and models. Maya is a professional program and barely holds any decent tutorials to pick up the basics, people are taught in classes. Either way, both Blender and Maya are good. I got a copy of Maya from my old boss who used to work with it on a professional level. He said that the program costs about $5000,- for the basic pack. o.O

Anyways, if you got any questions on Maya, just ask.

[trosh]

Yeah, Blender has allot of open source projects.

alot of open source

[Jorichi]

Yeah, Blender has allot of open source projects.

alot of open source

Sorry, Mr Grammarnazi sir. Please don't make me go to grammar camp.

[trosh]

I just wanted to make an alot joke since I read the article a few hours ago and then you go and say allot of open source projects. I had to.
Oh and

Sorry, Mr Grammarnazi sir.

you forgot the General.

[Camewel]

Yeah, Blender has allot of open source projects.

alot of open source

5 star post, would view again.

[LightningFire]

This has really gone OT, so Jorichi, please put a picture or 2 of your work so people can get entertained for a while.

[Jorichi]

There is not much to show you. All I've done was attaching the arms and legs of VR to his rump. But I did get the time to work out the story behind Virtual Reality on my phone. I apologize in advance to every grammarnazi out there (*cough* Trosh *cough* xD), my English isn't perfect.
I'm pretty sure I forgot to add some of my ideas to the basic story of it all, but I can't think of it at the moment...

Enjoy:

Code: Select all

Name: Virtual Reality, but often referred to as 'chip' for short.
Gender: Stallion.
Race: Unicorn.
CutieMark: A small chip.
Created by: Jorichi

Personality:
 A serious pony who tends to keep his thoughts to himself. Even though he is not
 shy to express himself, he still rather keeps his opinions to himself. The
 less the others know about him, the more 'safe' he feels.
 Virtual Reality thinks all his answers through and he never chooses a side in
 an argument, unless ofcourse the argument has a fact for an answer. Regardless
 of what many ponies might think of him, for those who actually do know him, he
 isn't afraid of socializing nor a good laugh, the moments just never occur.

Skills:
 Virtual Reality is a technologist. He dedicated himself to creating virtual
 realistic. Making dreams closer to reality. Where most technology stops with
 sight and sound, he could add touch/mass, smell and taste to it, stimulating
 all five senses. The key to achieving this is by using his magic in
 combination with his technology, something other ponies would never be able
 to do. With many of his creations only applying to his magic, he knows he can
 practically become a god. But Virtual Reality is a loyal pony, his mind
 wouldn't even think of it. But he is afraid that other ponies or monsters
 might want to, another reason for him to 'hide' his existence.

The past and present:
 Many years ago Virtual Reality had found the love of his life. But after a
 year or two he lost this true love in a horrible accident which he still
 relives in memory on a daily basis. It's one of the reasons, which he refuses
 to say is true, that he hardy leaves his house.
 Whenever somepony similar to his true love is seen, he freezes and locks up in
 memory, reliving the entire accident. The same goes for mentioning it.
 Not a night goes by that Virtual Reality wakes up from a horrible nightmare
 in the middle of the night.
 He dedicated his time and money in remaking his love. The result he got was
 outstandingly close to the real thing, but he couldn't bare to constantly
 relive the past. He pulled the plug on this project. Soon followed another,
 similar project, basically the same as the previous one, just a different look
 and personality. This hologram got named: Artificial Module-Y II, or A.M.Y II
 for short. This hologram, Amy, managed to take Virtual Reality's mind from
 reliving his past. Still, sometimes it's inevitable.

The present and future:
 Virtual Reality realized that his skills in creating 'virtual real' things was
 excising all other technology. He dedicated himself in refining his
 technology and use it to make dreams of other ponies come true.
 'What I did for myself I can do for others as well.' is what he keeps saying
 to himself.
 With his last project almost complete, he is willing to show his achievements
 to the rest of the world.

General Lifestyle:
 Virtual Reality has dedicated himself to his projects. He works on them in his
 basement of his humble home just outside Ponyville. During the day he is
 always working on one or more of his projects, even during weekends, events
 and holidays. During the night he, sometimes, goes out to get materials and
 supplies. He can walk the streets without being noticed, hardly any pony knows
 him.
 The only social interaction he gets are the ponies who supply him with the
 stuff he needs and the clients he works for. Virtual Reality gets his money
 by working for ponies who can use his skills in the art of holograms and such.
 One of his biggest clients is Vinyl Scratch, who hired him for her laser shows
 and such. However, he made Vinyl Scratch promise him to never even mention his
 name or existence.

Artificial Module-Y II:
 Amy is Virtual Reality's greatest creation. A secret room in Virtual Reality's
 basement is where she's controlled from. This room-sized computer can easily be
 considered Amy's heart. It's one of Virtual Reality's most secured rooms in
 his basement. This 'heart' allows Amy to 'summon' herself in a by Virtual
 Reality set radius from Virtual Reality himself. His horn functioning as a the
 beacon for this.
 Amy's realism was Virtual Reality's greatest goal in this project. He gave her
 a self developing personality and even a realistic 'learn and forget' function
 to make her be more like a real pony. Because Virtual had to raise her like a
 child and teach her everything there is to know, they developed a stronger bond
 then everypony else out there. For any pony who will meet her, she
 will be easily mistaken for a real pony, despite her illuminating appearance.
 Amy quickly became Virtual Reality's assistant in his projects, making his
 time spend in his basement much more efficient.

EDIT: Something to view.

I attached the limbs to the rumps.
The hips of A.M.Y were kind of annoying to get right in the rendered version (this is not rendered, obviously).
Next up is: VR's Horn, before I forget to add it. Then the eyes and mouths.

[Jorichi]

A few days ago I linked a stream in the IRC room, showing the progress on the ears.
This is how they turned out:
Amy's Ears. They look quite nice to me, it will look better with the hair added, which is next.
Scene view. I decided to fold the ears of Virtual Reality back, for more 'dramatic' effect in the scene. His ears are significantly thinner then Amy's.
Now for the hair (finally)!

[LightningFire]

I like it! But weren't you supposed to be making Derpy?